2002 CRF450 losing coolent
  • Cam121
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    Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2018 1:55 pm

    2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by Cam121 » Fri Jul 06, 2018 3:25 pm

    Howzit guys.

    First time poster. Got a 2002 today. Piston and rings about 1 hr on them, new valves and springs, shimmed by shop to spec. Problem is. Bought the bike and the first owner saif the gaskets were re-used.

    At this stage took it for a wuick test ride and after 20min (10km) of fast trail riding the coolent just poof... disappeared, to be exact, 650ml. Familliar with 4stroke and 2 strokes, this now is the first time experiencing this. On idle as normal bike heats up fast and spits coolent. But while riding. Bike is cool.

    Any ideas? Thanks and cheers
    YZ80/KX250/XR500/XL500/XT500/
    BANSHEE/DRZ400SM
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    JimDirt
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by JimDirt » Fri Jul 06, 2018 6:07 pm

    Welcome to the site !! \:D/

    Not sure on the amount of coolant lost , but when trail riding these bikes (i have a 02) do spit coolant as the radiators are smaller than the X and they just don't do well lugging on trails without a overflow tank , but i trail ride mine all the time , and in doing so i have mostly solved this issue , here is what i suggest

    Get a 1.6 or 1.8 Bar Radiator Cap , the stock 1.2 will allow coolant to burp out even at the slightest sign of heat , the higher pressure cap will allow the pressure to build higher before letting coolant out , so it will still spit fluid , but not as easily

    Next , go on eBay and find a 250X overflow bottle , you can mount it on the left rear by making a simple bracket and attach it to the seat and fender bolt , this will allow the majority of the coolant to go into the overflow tank , then when the bike cools , it returns to the radiator , you will still lose a slight amount from any steam that escapes , but you will never get 100% containment , so that is normal , even for the 250X and 450X

    Next is switch from coolant to either Engine Ice , or Evans Waterless Coolant , (read the directions carefully on flushing the system) , either of these will allow up to 50 degrees more temperature before a boil over , which along with the other recommendations i mentioned , should make you happy and able to ride the toughest of single track without worrying about boiling over and getting stuck out in the woods unless your sitting there idling for 5 minutes , then nothing will stop that unless you can add a cooling fan and a battery to run it

    Hopefully this gives you some ideas and a place to start....

    Here is my setup:
    Image
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    02 CRF450R
    06 CRF450X
    Image
    Weiser , Idaho
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    Cams121
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by Cams121 » Sat Jul 07, 2018 3:43 am

    Joe

    Thanks for the info. planning on exactly what your setup is. Just a bit more reliable in trails...

    Pulled the head and and saw where the coolent went. Gasket was not sealing properly so that is where 650ml of coolent went, to the combustion chamber and out the back. Can only get a gasket set on monday, so for now, vopper sealant will have to do the trick. I hope.

    Will let you know.
  • Cam121
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    Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2018 1:55 pm

    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by Cam121 » Sat Jul 07, 2018 11:56 am

    My bad!!! Jim (not Joe).

    Pulled head as said, dit the copper gasket spray.

    Found head was not in torque spec, did that, impellir functions got a lot more compression (faulty gaskets, head not torqued), bike starts amd idles well.

    Radiator cap is a 1.1. (From Honda dealer...). Still losing coolent fast. Cap is a major issue.second is the seeping hole. Is there a way to seal if off or do i have to change the seal on the shaft?. Think deal os the way to go.

    Let me know and thanks. Any decent thoughts welcome. Leka leka cheers!
    YZ80/KX250/XR500/XL500/XT500/
    BANSHEE/DRZ400SM
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    JimDirt
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by JimDirt » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:42 pm

    No problem , same guy ...... only different ... :-~

    Still losing coolant out the pipe ?? , or are you talking about the (first you mentioned this about the water pump leaking) weep hole for the water pump ???

    You did not mention the water pump seeping from the weep hole before :-k so confused about that , you will need to change the seal (pay attention to what way the seal faces) and check the water pump shaft for wear , if it has any kind of groove from the seal , then it needs to be replaced as well , you will also need to replace the head gasket ASAP , any aftermarket company (or eBay) should have a 1.6 or 1.8 Bar cap , and your dealer should be able to order one from whomever aftermarket company they deal with ....
    02 CRF450R
    06 CRF450X
    Image
    Weiser , Idaho
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    Cams121
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by Cams121 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 12:21 am

    Yes still losing out the pipe and then out the weeping hole too. Pulled off the glue previous owner used for sealing up the hole.

    Getting the cap and seal tomorrow. Head gasket hopefully by Tuesday. Depending on how lazy the sales guys will be as we do not have a Honda dealer here. Planning on putting up the computer fans and the reservoir setup too.

    This should be sufficient for fast paced trails, (maybe 1or 2 technical sections in a 90km trail).
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    JimDirt
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by JimDirt » Sun Jul 08, 2018 8:01 am

    Just remember the PC fans are not waterproof , so watch when washing the bike and hitting streams , as for the rest , you could get a aftermarket gasket kit online and be fine , i don't use OEM gaskets , about the only place i use OEM is Fork Seals , sucks not having a local dealer though , you can always shop here , Ken ships pretty much anywhere , pretty fast too and he does have OEM stuff ... and he has pretty much anything that is available for your bike
    https://www.crfsonly.com/catalog/index.php

    Also on the fans , be sure that they are drawing air thru the radiator not pushing forwards , and if they are PC fans , keep a few spares around , you will need them ..... ;)
    02 CRF450R
    06 CRF450X
    Image
    Weiser , Idaho
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    Cams121
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by Cams121 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 9:23 am

    Yes they are a bit weak those fans so woll make a plan there. It is a bit . with no dealer, but at least orders normally take about three days.

    Found the problem today amd was the waterpump shaft, worn badly, seals and doing the bearing.

    Also found the clutch releases good but when riding the clutch activates about 90%. Can feel it still turns the wheel. Got clutch out, might get a new one if it is done for.
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    JimDirt
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by JimDirt » Sun Jul 08, 2018 10:16 am

    Well , at least your finding all the issues now , and can get them resolved , so afterwards , you can just enjoy riding , on a side note , not necessary but , i run a full quart of oil in the transmission side , if you run on any high speed areas for long distances , it will keep the transmission from evacuating , as the cavity around the gears is very small , so the added oil will insure the gears are submersed in oil at all times and it won't hurt anything using the extra little amount you would normally omit , run the normal amount in the engine side ... i do this in my 450R and my 450X , just added failure reduction ...

    When the valves do go (and they will) , i would switch to Stainless Intakes , this will almost eliminate valve wear and adjustment , they will still wear , but it will take way longer ..... example , i installed Stainless Intakes in my 450X in 2006 as the original Titanium Intakes lasted only 6 months , I have not had to adjust them since , ..... in my 450R i installed them 3 years ago and have not had to adjust them since , i ride the R on the MX track pretty much every weekend (just getting ready to go there now right after i post this) , and on the weekends i am not at the track , i am either riding the X or riding the R off-road (the R currently gets ridden more than the X) , so they get a lot of use with little to no valve wear , i ride up until winter/snow hits , then they get torn down for maintenance like steering/swingarm/suspension/wheel bearings.... fresh oil/seals in the forks , maybe mess with the suspension valving , and this winter i will install a new clutch basket in the R , then i am ready to ride again in spring ..... O:)
    02 CRF450R
    06 CRF450X
    Image
    Weiser , Idaho
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    Cams121
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by Cams121 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 11:38 am

    Yes valve was the first thing i did. Put Pro X in as for some reason no one here (South Africa) could get the kibble white ss ones.

    So if all goes well upcoming weekend will bethe ride one. Must say like the performance with the power bomb fmf setup. Overall even though bike was not running 100% and a bit sticky, definitely had heap of power and gives the 450s (all newer) Ive ridden a massive go. Confident to say the bike will keep up. Just the clutch to work properly when pulled now.

    Enjoy the track
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    JimDirt
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by JimDirt » Sun Jul 08, 2018 4:58 pm

    Yea i believe stock they put out 54 hp , so its not bad , the "new" 17-18 450's put out about 60 hp , i really want one , but just can't afford it right now , when i pay off my truck in 3 years i will be 62 , so its hard to justify a $9,000 bike and 4 years of payments at that age

    For the valves , Ken (the owner here) could ship them there , no problem , so that is something to think about , he also does headwork and sells complete tricked out heads , and his prices are pretty fair , so maybe next time look into having him do the stuff , and he has very quick turn around .... so your not sitting around waiting for your stuff to arrive , the nice things about the mod or completed stock heads he has , is its just get the part and bolt it on and your ready to go , no messing around with getting someone to do machine work after you get your head redone or replaced ......
    02 CRF450R
    06 CRF450X
    Image
    Weiser , Idaho
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    Cams121
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by Cams121 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 10:44 pm

    Thanks. Will definitely rember that next time parts are needed.
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    Cams121
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by Cams121 » Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:22 am

    UPDATE:

    Decided to not buy clutch kit this time. Sent in outer to machine shop to get out the grooves formed. Inner is still good. Barely any grooves. Plates are still like new. 3mm and 1.6mm. Hope to get all parts by tomorrow and assembe.

    Will update again. Hopefully no more water loss out the weep hole and mixing with oils and head sealed. Did find that the decrimpessor clearance is way out. At 0.34 and nit the 0.63 it should be if this info is correct.
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    JimDirt
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by JimDirt » Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:38 am

    In you bottom picture the clutch basket looks pretty grooved , its about getting time for replacement of the basket , the grooves will cause the clutch to grab and be jerky at the lever , the sides of the basket where the protrusions on the plates keep the plates in place , should be smooth , there should not be ANY grooves at all , yours are deep enough to need attention , you can file the grooves smooth with a file for now , but it will start wearing again , so plan on a basket replacement by the end of the riding season , and the inner hub looks to be starting to groove as well, but its not as bad as the basket :(
    02 CRF450R
    06 CRF450X
    Image
    Weiser , Idaho
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    Cams121
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    Re: 2002 CRF450 losing coolent

    by Cams121 » Thu Jul 12, 2018 12:45 pm

    Yes Jim that is correct. Both are in for machining at a mates place so winning some $$$ there. Planning on a new setup after this one is stuffed.Want to use the last life out of this fellow before getting a new setup in there. New setup will run around $750. (What i paid for the bike)
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