[dsrpilot]

Here is one for the very learned colleagues on the site.

My 11 year old and I were adjusting the valves on his '04 CRF80.

I let him put the valve cover on with the two bolts while I put the left crankcase cover back on.

I thought I had started both of the bolts for him, but apparently I didn't and he started one of the bolts at a little bit of an angle and wrenched it down too much before he asked if he was doing it correctly.

So we took the cover back off, and although the bolt threads looked fine, the threads in the head looked a little tweaked. I worked the bolt in by hand easily and then back out and did get a little bit of aluminum thread off of it. It wasn't much, so we cleaned that up and tried to put the cover back on.

While putting it on, I could feel the bolt start to strip as after tightening it began to get easier to turn. I immediately stopped tightening it before it stripped completely. **DRATS** I thought we had gotten lucky, but I guess not.

So the cover is on reasonably tight for now, but I don't know if it might vibrate loose as he rides it in the spring. Certainly, the cover won't come off again without addressing the situation.

What to do now? Can the bolt hole be tapped out or will I have to replace the head?
Should I wait until spring and see if it holds or just bite the bullet now while it's cold? I'll probably take it to someone to do the work as I think it might be more than I'm willing to attempt.

Whadda think?? Anybody...

[Asmith]

A small HeliCoil should cure the problem. Most shops can do that for a few bucks.

[dsrpilot]

Thanks for the quick reply!!!

I called my local honda shop and they recommended time-serts over heli-coil as they feel that everytime you unscrew the bolt from a heli-coil you could get small metal slivers from it.

They told me with the time-serts the hole is drilled out and the time-sert is glued in making it more permament.

Are they BSing me?

[slomotobug]

Timeserts are definitely the way to go if there is enough meat to install them, MUCH more of a permanent fix than helicoils. I've been using them for over a decade now and never had one fail. They are even tough enough to be used in aluminum heads when spark plugs are stripped out.

[Asmith]

The HeliCoils are fine for that application. Low torque, low stress and the Helicoil Threads are STEEL so there will NOT be any shavings...they are BS'ing you.

If they will do the Timesert for the same price as a HeliCoil ($ 20 or so...) then fine. Otherwise, go somewhere else.

[dsrpilot]

Oh, they're not talking about $20 for sure.

Being a Honda dealer, they're talking about 1 hour or so at $64/hour.
Assured me it would be less than $100.

Guess I'll call around a bit more...
The $20 price sounds about right.

If anyone knows of a reputable shop in the Pittsburgh, PA area please don't be shy.

After viewing the youtube videos on both products, it doesn't look that hard, but you gotta have the kit with all the special tools.

~, maybe you should open an East Coast shop, eh?

[Asmith]

Oh, they're not talking about $20 for sure.

Being a Honda dealer, they're talking about 1 hour or so at $64/hour.
Assured me it would be less than $100.

Guess I'll call around a bit more...
The $20 price sounds about right.

If anyone knows of a reputable shop in the Pittsburgh, PA area please don't be shy.

After viewing the youtube videos on both products, it doesn't look that hard, but you gotta have the kit with all the special tools.

~, maybe you should open an East Coast shop, eh?

The commute would be a bitch though...

[dsrpilot]

Yeah, but look how much time you would get in the saddle !!!

You could take all the off-road trails back and forth...

[Asmith]

Yeah, but look how much time you would get in the saddle !!!

You could take all the off-road trails back and forth...

I can tell you are a glass half full kinda guy.

[slomotobug]

The HeliCoils are fine for that application. Low torque, low stress and the Helicoil Threads are STEEL so there will NOT be any shavings...they are BS'ing you.

If they will do the Timesert for the same price as a HeliCoil ($ 20 or so...) then fine. Otherwise, go somewhere else.

What do you have against timeserts agent? I can understand the original investment on kits and tools is a little more, but once you have all the kits as most dealers do, the cost is only slightly more than a helicoil, and as far as my experience goes using and installing both in numerous aplications, the timesert is far more effective for long term repairs regardless of the application. just my $.02

[Asmith]

Nothing against Timeserts...they are just overkill and overpriced for some applications.

The HeliCoil works very well in applications such as the OP describes. It is fast, inexpensive, easy to do and permanent.

[dsrpilot]

From viewing the youtube tutorials on how to install each, they seem very similar:

1. drill out the hole
2. tap the hole
3. With the time-serts you have to countersink for the lip at this point. Not necessary with helicoil.
4. install the insert
5. with the Helicoil you have to break off the tang. Not necessary with the time-serts.
6. Put the bolt in and tighten that sucker down!

So, I don't know anything about the cost of the kits or of the insert themselves, but from a time perspective they don't seem that different.

Am I missing something?

Is this a little like a Honda vs Yamaha kind of religious war?

[bosshaug1]

The kit for a helicoil or permacoil can be found at most autoparts stores and generally costs about $25-30 for everything to repair one size of stripped bolt.

It IS very easy to do. If I can - you can too